An Interview with Advocate Lauren Johnson
Lauren Johnson, MPH has a graduate degree in environmental science and policy, and is a Climate Corps fellow for the Environmental Defense Fund. Lauren founded the Environmental Justice Action Network at the George Washington University and specializes on advancing environmental justice.
Theresa Nair: Thank you for joining us today for this installment of the Seattle Psychiatrist Interview Series. I'm Theresa Nair, a research intern at Seattle Anxiety Specialists. Today, I'd like to welcome with us Lauren Johnson, who has a master of public health in environmental science and policy, and is a Climate Corps fellow for the Environmental Defense Fund. During her time as a graduate student, Lauren founded the Environmental Justice Action Network at the George Washington University, which is a student-led organization working to address environmental justice issues in the metropolitan D.C. area. In her current fellowship with the Environmental Defense Fund, she focuses on advancing environmental justice through strategic planning, scientific research, data-driven project management and community engagement. Before we get started, can you tell us a little more about yourself and what made you interested in environmental justice?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah. So, hi. My name is Lauren Johnson. I'm from Northern Virginia, the D.C. area. And I just graduated with my master of public health in environmental science and policy from George Washington University's public health school. And ever since before public health school, even, I fell in love or became passionate about environmental justice issues when I was teaching high school chemistry in Miami, Florida for Teach for America. And there, I was confronted with various systems of oppression, such as lack of literacy, deteriorated infrastructure, school to prison pipeline, and was very disheartened by seeing how our nation's most vulnerable groups of people are treated, and left with little resources and so much instability, to reach their full potential. And that's what motivated me to focus on these issues at a systemic level. And I saw that public health was an avenue of doing so. And brought my passion of environmental justice into public health school, which led to the founding of the Environmental Justice Action Network at GW.
And that was founded by me and about seven other people that were also passionate about environmental justice, but did not see an avenue of expressing it at the school. And even though there's been a lot of mentioning of it, there really wasn't organized effort for students to get involved and give back to their surrounding community, because that's also a central tenant of environmental justice, of having real impacts in communities, and especially communities that are most vulnerable. So we found ourselves in Southeast D.C. doing park cleanups, urban gardens. We also held a lot of webinars, bringing more disadvantaged speakers, such as Indigenous environmental activists or food justice activists, so that we can start elevating these intersectional issues to the forefront, and also challenge traditional environmentalism that does not have these issues in the forefront, but is so needed to us actually reaching our climate goals. So that perspective informs my career work at the Environmental Defense Fund, which I am going to be a permanent member in a couple weeks.
Theresa Nair: That's wonderful. Congratulations.
Lauren Johnson: Thank you.
Theresa Nair: And so going back a little bit to when you started the Environmental Justice Action Network, what types of environmental justice issues did you see in D.C., and how did you decide what was important to prioritize?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah, so we were starting EJAN, the shorthand for it, during COVID-19. So we were quite limited in terms of direct engagement with people, just for social distancing guidelines and guidelines that the school laid out for that, as well, that we had to abide by. But we saw there was a pressing need with pollution in Southeast D.C., Ward 7 and 8, and how a lot of people did not have proper trash pickup. So we would drive into these areas and just see trash littered everywhere. And you kind of have to keep it in perspective, well, if you don't have proper trash pickup, where are you going to put the trash? So that's when you can't blame the individual, but the system that allows these conditions to persist, and how they are inequitably perpetuated, because we saw some parks that are managed by the National Park Service that was full of trash. When you go to Rock Creek Park, you don't see that. What's the difference between the two areas?
Theresa Nair: Right.
Lauren Johnson: I think you can answer that in terms of income and race. So, we saw those issues most aptly and saw that that was a way to socially distance and engage in these types of work. And we also partnered with an urban garden called the Franciscan Monastery Garden Guild, that produces a lot of food to food insecure individuals by donating a lot to food kitchens and pantries. So, we saw those were the main ways we could engage in EJ within COVID-19. But other than that, our activities were virtual; in terms of meeting, holding webinars, and just trying to educate ourselves as future EJ practitioners.
Theresa Nair: Okay. And just before we continue, I want to make sure, if any listeners are not familiar with the term environmental justice, could you explain a little bit more about what exactly it is and what it means and how it impacts different communities?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah. So environmental justice came out of the late 1970s where... I believe it was PCB. There was this new industry being proposed to be put in a predominantly Black community, Warren County, North Carolina. And the residents organized extremely well and were able to stop those efforts by literally putting themselves on the line. You look at pictures of that protest and you saw kids laying on the ground trying to stop trucks going into their neighborhood. That's how pressing the issue is for these communities, because literally their lives are on the line, so they have to put their lives on the line to stop it.
And that's what spurred the movement. And since then, in the '80s, there was a report called Toxic Waste and Race that found that the strongest predictor of whether a pollution source is in a community is race, regardless of income is race. So again, I'm talking about systems. That is evidence of systemic racism and how these trends perpetuate all over the country. And then from then, environmental justice became this movement that kept becoming academic. What is environmental racism? Well, just dependent on the environment, you are subject to lack of clean water, polluted air, mold, pest infestations, things that, even if you control for income, affects our predominantly Black and brown populations.
And then that notion just kept perpetuating until in 2021, Biden released an executive order that was pretty much codifying environmental justice at the forefront of their priorities, because prior to that in the 1990s, there was an executive order assigned by Clinton that also recognized environmental justice and how federal agencies need to confront it. But this executive order put it to the forefront with an initiative called Justice40 that says that any Federal... I think energy and infrastructure investments, 40% has to go to disadvantaged communities. So that's really huge, right?
Theresa Nair: Yeah.
Lauren Johnson: Because when you want change, you need to have the capital follow with it. So basically, environmental justice captures a lot of things. It captures how people are adversely affected by the environment, disproportionally predicted by race, most strongly; very place-based in terms of the surrounding industries and factors that lead to pollution; cumulatively burden certain communities. And achieving environmental justice means upholding the principle that everyone has equal protection to environmental, housing, criminal, other such laws that affects every aspect of your life. That's the environmental part, expanding the definition of environment for everything that externally affects you. And EJ is about rectifying that.
Theresa Nair: When we were talking a few minutes before the interview started, you mentioned how systematic engineering can help to solve some of these problems. Would you mind discussing that a little bit, and how systematic engineering could be applied in these situations?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah, yeah. So this is a new discipline that just kind of happened. When I started working in the Environmental Defense Fund, I saw that someone was doing a similar study that I was, from a systems engineering perspective. And essentially, there are some tools available from more technical disciplines to assess the inputs and outputs of a system, and everything that takes place in the system that mediates or negotiates the resulting outputs. That can be applied to a social context where, for example, I'm doing a study on net zero and equity and justice. And I'm trying to create recommendations for my organization to uphold their equity and justice goals.
So the equity and justice goals are the output. Now, what can the input be? Well, to achieve that, you need to really have resources, meaning time and people and capital to be put in the types of projects that prioritize people-centered solutions that do not perpetuate existing injustices. But if you don't view that from a systems lens, then you could easily result to just blaming individuals, like, "We have some bad actors here. If we get rid of those, we'll be good."
Well, we know that doesn't work when, let's say, a similar issue is police brutality. You know firing a few bad cops is not going to change the system of people being systemically murdered, predicted by race. So in turn, you need to think about things in that lens, and the mental models, the different structures. Everything interacts with each other to produce a certain output. And to reach the output that you want, you need to change everything within the system and outside the system and how it's structured, to reach it.
Theresa Nair: That's a great point, because I think a lot of times people do just want to blame one person or a handful of people, but it's so much of a bigger problem than that, that it really needs a much bigger solution. If I could do one more spinoff, just because we were talking about such interesting things before I started recording, could you talk a little bit also about the relationship between the environmental movement and environmental justice, and how those two can sometimes conflict a little bit?
Lauren Johnson: Oh man, I was just having a conversation about this. So it helps to talk about the history. Environmental movement was spurred by... I believe his name was John Muir, who was pushing the national parks movement. And I may be getting this wrong. I also know Teddy Roosevelt was involved in the national park system, but hey. "We're concerned about the environment. It's pretty. Nature. Wildlife. Let's preserve it." Well, who was on this land before? Indigenous peoples. They lived for thousands of years, existing sustainably on the land. So prior to colonization, people are like, "Oh wow, this nature, it's so well kept." That's because people were keeping it. And we're finding now that there's some practices that are ingrained in Indigenous knowledge that we need to start doing, such as controlling fires in forests or cutting some of them down so it's not densely populated. Indigenous peoples figured that out thousands of years ago, and now we're coming around and realizing we need to do stuff like that, because we have so many wildfires now.
So there's always been this tension of people, typically white liberal, "We need to protective the environment. We need to protect our wildlife." That's true. We also need to protect the people that is in that environment. And that's the intersection that is left out, and many others. Gender, race, income, all those things factor into how much you can take care of the environment and how much the environment impacts you. And coming from an environmental justice side to that, there's a lot of tensions because like... we were talking about systems. EJ really pushes for you to confront those issues. And that makes you very uncomfortable with it.
So a lot of people, when they become uncomfortable, they'll shut down and say, "Well, that's not my focus. That has nothing to do in the environment." The environment is everything around you that affects you. So yeah, you should have a stake in all this. And if you're doing environmental work, you also need to talk about healthcare. You also need to talk about housing, the criminal justice system, because these are things that impacts everyone's environment. And we all need to be an equal stakeholder in solving it, because otherwise we can't have a systemic change that is needed to solve the climate crisis.
Theresa Nair: Yeah, I think that's an important point. You can't really separate all of it. It's kind of the one-health approach, that everything is connected together and it all relates to each other. When you've been working with communities and residents on some of these environmental justice issues, what types of mental health impacts have you seen on the communities who are experiencing some of these disparities or discrimination?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah, I would say I was confronted with that quite aptly when I was teaching. I decided to Teach for America in Miami, Florida, a very hot and humid place that... I read one site that says that the number one most economic risk to climate impacts. So for the students I taught, one time, I got a grant to do a hurricane disaster preparedness workshop for those students. And somehow during that workshop, we started talking about air pollution. And I ended up asking those students, "How many of you have asthma?" And over half the class raised their hand. That's not-
Theresa Nair: That’s significant.
Lauren Johnson: ...random. That's the system at play where you're in these conditions, like I said, hot and humid, you have a lot of mold, you have a lot of pests, you have on top of that industries near you that are affecting your health through air pollution and water pollution. And then now you're compounding that with climate change and sea level rise, extreme weather. All those things are going to heighten those existing conditions there.
And so that's kind of what climate justice is all about. And the ways that we are addressing our climate-related causes, you need to make sure that the people that are most adversely affected are uplifted in that transition because, well, one, usually they're the ones that are least responsible for causing it; just looking upon income, the more income you have, the more greenhouse gas footprint you have. And oh man, I can't even get into a large conversation about how corporations are part of that too, but-
Theresa Nair: You can feel free, if you like. Yeah.
Lauren Johnson: But these factors, they compound. And it causes a lot of anxiety. I even had to make a suicide attempt call to report that.
Theresa Nair: Wow.
Lauren Johnson: And I mean, these are environmental things, but this also controls people's behavior. If you're in this bad environment and you're also not concerned about education, even though it's a school, that's another thing, you're going to have all these things mentally impact the students that you have. And oftentimes I just had to put on my therapist hat and just be there talking to students, had some people cry on my shoulder, just know that I care about them. And if anything, sometimes that's one of the few times they even heard that, which is also really sad.
Theresa Nair: Wow, that is.
Lauren Johnson: Yeah, mental health is very tied into it. But one thing you need to make sure is that climate anxiety has become something very real. It's a very real thing, but that is because this might be the first time you have this existential threat to your livelihood.
Theresa Nair: Right.
Lauren Johnson: To keep that in perspective, that has already been a thing for many groups of people in this country, whether it be slavery, Jim Crow, migrant workers, elderly, just people with disabilities. They've already had these existential threats affecting their livelihood. So, you have to recognize your identity and your privilege when you're addressing these issues because you might be like, "Oh my gosh, you need to do something about it at all costs. Everyone just needs to get in line." Well, that's not good enough for a lot of people that's already suffering from occurring conditions. So, you just have to keep things in perspective, even when it affects you mentally.
Theresa Nair: That's a good point that a lot of groups have been dealing with these threats for a long time. And for some people, this is the first time they're experiencing something like this, but other groups have been dealing with this on an ongoing basis.
So, when people start to feel overwhelmed and feel like these are just huge issues, where do you even start addressing it? What advice would you give for people who are just feeling overwhelmed when they think about these topics? Because we're talking about these major systematic problems, right, that I think the average person feels like there's not really anything they can do much about. So what advice do you give? Like, you seem to be able to stay inspired and feel like you can make a difference. And I think that's amazing. It's one of the reasons I wanted to interview you. This is incredible, how you stay inspired in the face of all this. But I think a lot of people look at some of these topics and they just feel frustrated. So what advice would you give for people who just look at this and they just think, "I can't change any of this"?
Lauren Johnson: Well, first, I'll say check your privilege, because there's a lot of people overwhelmed for hundreds of years in this country. But also, I'll take a quote from one of my environmental professors at public health school: "You need to find the bubble of people and work that you can influence, and just focus on that."
So, for me, I know that I grew up in a pretty privileged upbringing. And even though I'm a Black woman, I still had a lot of opportunities and came from a two-parent household that also was very stable. So that means I've been able to gain a really robust education. Part of my skillset is talking to White people, so I'll just call that out too. And then also, just thinking about the big picture. So that's why I found that I can make a lot of impact in a big environmental organization because all those skills I had growing up, but I can also keep things in perspective and saying, "Well, I know that I'm quite privileged, but there's a lot of other people that look like me that aren't. And how about I can do what I can to level the playing field, per se, and actually make an impact in doing that at an organization that has international influence?"
Very challenging and difficult work, but I found myself on a team that is designed to do just that. And they're extremely motivated. And what keeps me going is thinking about the students I had in Miami. They are suffering in many different ways. It seems like I might have some skills that can do something about that. And that might be me getting ahead of myself and saying, "I'm going to fix everything." No, no, no. But what I can do is expand the platform I have and try to get as many people on the same page as possible so that authentic and meaningful change does happen as we're addressing the climate crisis.
Theresa Nair: That's great. And I think you hit on one of the key points, that you work with other people who are also inspired. Finding maybe a group or an organization to work with where people are working towards a positive difference, right, I think that that can help. And then you have also the inspiration of who you want to help, thinking about your former students.
Let's talk a little bit about your work in Texas. I know last year you worked with the North Central Texas Council of Governments to develop a greenhouse gas emission reduction plan that will mitigate risk for underserved communities. Could you tell us about your work there and how underserved communities in that area are being impacted by climate change?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah, for sure. For sure. So that project you just mentioned took place last summer. And just as a context, Texas is actually divided into all these regional council of governments, and they assist the local governments in making decisions and providing funding. Well, a collection of those local governments approached the North Central Texas Council of Governments, which is the Dallas-Fort Worth area, saying, "Hey, we know climate change is a thing. Why don't you give us this repository of strategies and tools to address it in our own communities?"
So that was the basis for the project, which is looking at all these different plans that were cultivated in Texas or the rest of the country, even some international organizations, of these strategies. Well, I'll say a lot of them are untested though, because a lot of things that we're proposing to solve climate change, they're still in a development phase. But if a government wants to do something in particular, well, then they can... Well, I hope it's being turned into an online repository. I just did the strategies. They can look at some strategies that can reduce some emissions. But like I was saying, you can't leave out the other side of the picture, that there are some people that are burdened by emissions, but more specifically air pollutants. And those are the things that are most concerned.
So I tried to position the recommendations and the strategies around those different pollutions, and know that you can both reduce emissions from these industries, but also clean them up so that surrounding communities are not disproportionally affected. And that was the level of engagement I could have with vulnerable communities with that project. But I also was able to use some GIS mapping to look at the trends of different pollution sources, so whether that be natural gas or oil, power plants or Superfund sites, and look at some data that approximated the distribution of health impacts, whether that be asthma, cancer, diabetes, and then see how the location of those pollution sources interacted with those health disparities.
It was almost very upsetting how much those health disparities aligned with where those pollution sources were. And I used something called the CDC Social Vulnerability Index that takes into account a lot of social factors like age and race and language proficiency to measure the vulnerability of certain communities. And I found the most vulnerable were right near these pollution sources. And that could just be a highway right next to you. But some of the most burdened communities... There was one in Fort Worth. It had the lowest life expectancy, I believe in the whole state of Texas. And they were actually right across from a hospital, but because it's this really major roadway was separating them and the hospital, they were completely cut out from any healthcare access. And likely the effects of the roadway near them and a number of other pollution issues, that causes them to have ridiculous rates of different diseases, and then caused such a lower life expectancy.
So, when I talk about environmental justice, this really is a life and death matter, and should thus be treated with that urgency, because as we're trying to change our society to affect climate change, you need to make sure that there's communities already suffering, and this is an opportunity to do something about it.
Theresa Nair: Yeah, sometimes people don't realize what a difference even just living right next to an interstate makes on your overall health, just breathing in that pollution every day. And of course it's usually wealthier people tend to live further from the interstate and aren't impacted as much, right? Something like that can have such an impact on your health.
We've been talking about these environmental justice issues that are in Texas and D.C., and we talked about Miami a little bit. Many of our listeners are in the Pacific Northwest, and they may not know what environmental issues are in their city or even how to find out about that topic. How could the average person who may not be very familiar with the environmental justice problems in their area find out more about some of the problems in their local communities and the disparities that exist?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah, yeah. So, it's good that I've learned a lot of cities or local governments are really thinking about these issues, especially with the Biden administration setting high priorities for environmental justice and like Justice40 providing funding to vulnerable communities. So, I would say the first resource you can go to locally is check your local government website. See if they have something listing what they're doing about environmental and social issues that are affecting the area. I think that's the best way to get more local base. But if you could quickly search what local organizations are also confronting those issues, like type in "Environmental justice" and your community. You can see if there's any other organizations there that might have some local knowledge.
But there is also a lot of just national organizations and movements that are trying to put these issues into light. And that could just be some of the renowned environmental justice organizations like we have for environmental justice, the Deep South Center for ... Deep South Center for Justice ... Oh, man. I messed this up.
Theresa Nair: That's okay.
Lauren Johnson: But this is an organization led by Dr. Beverly Wright in the Cancer Alley area. It does a lot of work there. And even the major environmental organizations too, like I work at Environmental Defense Fund, we're also thinking about these things. There should be a decent amount of resources there to think about it. And also nationally, the EPA, Environmental Protection Agency, DOE, the Department of Energy, they're also putting out resources to think about these issues, but also mapping and screening tools to actually you can go in, type in your address, and you can see the different pollution sources or demographic issues that are coming into play your area.
So for example, the EPA, they have something called EJScreen, that you can do this. The CDC has Environmental Public Health Tracking Program, that you can do this. And if you live in California, the California EPA is really on top of these issues. And you can look to see how they're affecting you through a tool called CalEnviroScreen. So, there's a lot of resources and things sprinkled throughout here, but what we need is a more robust movement of joining forces and understanding we're on the same side of trying to figure things out, and working together to do so.
Theresa Nair: Yeah, I think that's the important point, because a lot of times people might want to help if they know about it, but they may not even know that some of these problems exist in their neighborhoods, or where the tools are to find out about it. And I will link to some of the tools that you mentioned below this interview as well, so that people at least listening to this interview can find them.
If a person is experiencing anxiety due to living in an urban area, and maybe they're worried about things like the pollution from the interstate, if they live nearby, or heat islands, or they've noticed that they have higher rates of asthma in their neighborhood, some of these topics that we've discussed, what type of advice would you give to them?
Lauren Johnson: Yeah. Yeah. I would say just really try to figure out what those different things are; like you said, the urban heat island, it could be a lot of allergens that you're affected by, the interstates. Just really understand how all these issues are. And then find people trying to do something about it, because there's a lot of really great local nonprofits that provide free assistance to ... let's say you're in an urban heat island and don't have good AC. Well, there's a lot of nonprofits that have programs funded for you to get that for free. And then that can intersect with healthcare as well. There's a lot of great organizations that may be local to you that can do that as well.
But really the issue isn't individually how we respond to this, the issue is our representatives, the people we elect, pushing policies that can actually do something about this. For example, why isn't it mandated in affordable housing to have AC? Isn't that a necessity nowadays, especially with heat waves and climate change?
Theresa Nair: Right.
Lauren Johnson: We need to petition our representatives and senators to do something about it. And if you not just send an email, but if you are able to get on the call online with someone, then I've been told by number of local legislators they will listen to that and try to do something about it, because maybe they have a ballot initiative coming up and are debating it, if you could be someone in the public forum or speaking setting to talk to these people directly. And I would advise, start at the local level too, because those are the people that really are making decisions that impact you locally. You can bring your perspectives up, and they may pivot entirely. You never know. So there are ways to stay empowered throughout this. And really just realize knowledge is power, and you do have something to do about it.
Theresa Nair: Have you seen that happen? Have you seen someone completely drastically change their mind after being contacted on one of these issues?
Lauren Johnson: Not directly, but I have heard offline, these are ways to really make an impression, because for example, part of the reason why I fell into EJ is I started working with a nonprofit called Catalyst Miami in Miami, Florida. And they did a lot of free training and resources to empower local residents to talk to their representatives or a city board meeting, and how to do that. A lot of it is just telling your personal stories and how things have personally affected you, and then saying a solution too. They'll be empathetic, but if you don't put anything on the table what to do about it, they probably won't get there either. So you could go there. And like I said, there was a local nonprofit that was training us to do that. And I saw people throughout that program really find their voice, encouraged to talk about these issues, how they affect them, and what is something we can do about it.
Theresa Nair: That's an important point, because it's true, a lot of times people who make these decisions aren't in the community, and they might make decisions that wouldn't even work for the community. But if community members who are affected themselves are the ones suggesting solutions, then they know that that's the solution that would work best, from their perspective. And then they can at least consider it, whereas they may not even think about it if somebody doesn't contact them.
Lauren Johnson: Right, exactly. It's very powerful, the storytelling really is. So, I hope people don't lose sight of that because there's been such a push to quantifying things, big data, technical. Well, I'm finding with EJ, the social dimensions of all that is being left out. So that's why I'm training myself to be a social science practitioner, where my current study, I'm talking to a lot of people through ... well, I'm actually doing my own interviews. I'm having a focus group tonight to start talking candidly about these types of issues, and what are some ways we can do them ... well, for me, as a big environmental organization, do something about it, and not leave people behind?
So, there are things. Again, we were talking about, what are things you can influence? Well, that's my sphere. I think about people in communities and try to bring them in the conversation. Well, you can figure that out for you too, whether that be from a more technical side or social side. We need everyone, all hands on deck to meaningfully and authentically address these issues.
Theresa Nair: Yeah, you're right. That's true. Well, as a professional who's building your career around advocacy and addressing environmental justice issues, do you have any parting words or final things you'd like to share with our listeners?
Lauren Johnson: Well, I'll say the fight is long, the fight is hard, but it's still worth doing it. And it sounds cliche, my favorite MLK quote, but this one's good, and he's also said a lot of things that are good. They're just kind of whitewashed over time. But this one is, "The moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends towards justice." So if you are fighting for something you truly believe in and truly believe in helping people and pushing us forward as a society that's more fair and equitable and just, we're going to be going to that position naturally as people.
Whether we'll get there fast enough with climate change happening is another question, but things are already moving that direction. So, if you feel like you're the only person caring about these things, if anything, people will come around to it. But the urgency is that we kind of are on a ticking clock now with how worse issues can be if we don't reach our greenhouse gas emission targets. So be urgent, know that these issues matter in our life and death, but try to remember that this fight is worth having at the end of the day, because you can truly improve lives to the better doing so.
Theresa Nair: Right. That's a great note to end on, that it's worth fighting and that it's worth going through and worth continuing to work towards these solutions. Well, thank you so much for speaking with us today and participating in our interview series. I really appreciate you making time in your busy schedule to meet with us.
Lauren Johnson: For sure. Thank you for having me. If anyone wants to follow up, I'm happy to put my email address there. I can send that to you.
Theresa Nair: Okay, great. We'll put your contact information there. And so yeah, if anyone feels like they would like to contact you, we'll provide the information on how they can do so. Okay. Thank you.
Please note: The views expressed by the interviewee are for educational and informational purposes only, are not meant to diagnose or treat any condition, and do not necessarily reflect the views of Seattle Anxiety Specialists, PLLC.
Editor: Jennifer (Ghahari) Smith, Ph.D.